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People Attack the No Kill Equation with the No kill Equation, I find this very confusing

People Attack the No Kill Equation with the No Kill Equation, I find this very confusing

This is in a comment left on a pervious blog post.  I find it very confusing when people attack No Ill because we should Spay/Neuter or we have to improve adoptions.  I guess they don’t read what they are attacking.  It is very odd.

Anyway, below is the comment with my replies after each attack.  Hell I agree with them most of the time.  Of course, I did read what they had to say.

“The reality is: There are 68 no-kill shelters following the no-kill equation and according to HSUS there are 3,500 shelters overall =1.9% no-kill shelters.”

Yes, and they are growing.  There were a handful 2 years ago.  Amazing growth right?

 These no-kill shelters are failing miserably by turning away animals to unknown fates.

This is simply an excuse used by kill shelter defenders to justify the killing of millions of animals.

 “The reality is: 190 no-kill communities out of 38,141 communities total =.5 % served.”

This does not help you argument, it simply shows more needs to be done.  That’s what No Kill and other movements are working to improve. 

“3-4 million animals are killed a year at shelters.”

And No Kill is working to eliminate that number. 

“The majority animals killed at shelters are the hardest to place: 2.3 million adult cats & 900,000 pit bull type dogs are killed a year.”

I have never seen the figure 900,000 pit bulls are killed each year in shelters.  Please let me know where that comes from.  I would like ot know if it is verifiable.  Irrelevant to justifiable killing of them, but an interesting fact nonetheless.  You don’t have to place most of the cats.  Most shelters claim the majority of the cats they kill are feral.  TNR would take care of most cats overnight. 

“We have an overpopulation of adult cats & pit bull type dogs and you can’t force the public to adopt these animals. “

No, but you can convince them that these are wonderful animals.  And killing them is not a solution. And overpopulation is a myth according to not only the No Kill movement, but HSUS, ASPCA and many others.

  “And to blame shelters for the preferences of the general public is criminal. “

Actually, that’s not criminal.  And the preference of the general public is not to kill healthy helter pets.

 “It’s estimated there are over 70 million feral/strays, mostly cats.”

Good for them.  Much safer than being a shelter cat. 

You need to factor this number into your math equation too: In ONE DAY; EVERYDAY over 733,000 puppies are advertised online by breeders. It’s very hard for middle-aged to senior cats and pit-bull type dogs to compete with those odds stacked against them.

It is hard, and it is our responsibility to make it harder for these people to continue breeding and selling.  We need to market better.  The 733,000 number seems a bit over blown.  I might believe 733,000 advertisements each day, not individual puppies.  I imagine it is multiple ads for the same company/puppy/organization.  Advertising online is essentially free.  Its the same reason we cross post homeless pets.  Each cross post is not another homeless pet, just an additional chance of getting it out there.  But if you have proof of that many available puppies per day, I would be interested to see it.

 “We need to spay and neuter and limit breeding for no kill to work for all animals.”

TNR and SPAY/Neuter are two programs and services of the No Kill Equation.  I have never met a No Kill Advocate that believes puppy mills are anything but evil, and many don’t even approve of what some people would call the handful of good breeders out there.  You have 100% agreement on this.

 Nathan Winograd uses dangerous rhetoric that kills shelter pets by denying pet overpopulation. “

It actually isn’t dangerous.  It actually moves many people to stop saying “killing is a kindness”,  “necessary”, or the “best thing for the animals”.  It gets them to say killing is a morally corrupt choice and lifesaving alternatives must be pursued. 

“It encourages people NOT to spay & neuter their pets if they think we don’t have a pet overpopulation problem.”

Again – Spay Neuter AND TNR are part of the 11 points in the No Kill Equation.  This is a ridiculous point as you are agreeing with the issue you are attacking. 

“It also encourages people to overlook shelter pets & buy from a breeder instead.”

Absurd, again I will go to the No Kill Equation which demands a comprehensive adoption program, community outreach, foster programs and is pretty much completely geared to get people to adopt.  I am fascinated by your leap (off a cliff) of logic. 

“Mr. Winograd spends most of his time disparaging the most effective animal groups: HSUS, PETA, ASPCA. “

These groups are not effective in helping SHELTER pets that need to get out of a shelter today.  But they happily market to their donators that this is the type of organization they are.  I realize some help on spay neuter.  But PETA kill 90% of the pets it takes into it shelter, and they are not unhealthy untreatable.  PETA also believes in killing Pit Bulls and feral cats.  Sorry, Can’t abide by that.  The others have their own issues with the way they address shelters.  But in the end, together they could end the killing today if they wanted to with the $300 million they have to spend. 

“I think No-kill leader, Peter Marsh has a more effective plan & has been proven to work in New Hampshire and is considered a no-kill state. “

Good.  If something works, promote it.  What I read of Peter Marsh sounded good.  I will read up more on him.  If no healthy or treatable animals are being killed in New Hampshire, that’s great.  I looked at what they are doing, and basically they have implemented parts or all of the No Kill Equations.  So super, we agree again on the approach. 

“He admits we have a pet overpopulation crisis and we can’t adopt our way out of this mess. Mr. Marsh says we need to actively seek out the people that can’t afford to spay & neuter their pets that’s creating 80% of the pet overpopulation. This is top priority to STOP the faucet of pet overpopulation so animals don’t end up in shelters in the first place. http://www.shelteroverpopulation.org/”

Super, keep up the good work on spay/neuter.  I am really very confused by you constantly using programs and services of the No Kill Equation to attack the No Kill Equation.  It’s kind of exhausting. 

 “Caught on camera, 4 no-kill shelters that are following the no-kill equation turning away animals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P79Vgvo6b8″

This is an absurd video.  You can go into shelters all across the country to show cruelty, abuse, killing in gas chambers, by gun, poorly executed heart stick and any other method you can think of.  Would this mean you should eliminate all those shelters?  Would this prove No Kill is the only way to go?  This video, produced by PETA, the killer of more than 90% of the animals entering the ONLY shelter they run, is pure propaganda.  They could have taken this money and saved some of the lives they killed.   They are a disgrace to the homeless pet community and you should be the first to say it.

2 thoughts on “People Attack the No Kill Equation with the No kill Equation, I find this very confusing”

  1. Even Peter Marsh has rescinded the pet overpopulation theory. He now discusses shelter overpopulation which is very different. This means that shelters can get overcrowded but not that there are not enough homes for the pets at the shelter or at large in society. Shelter overpopulation usually occurs because they don’t follow protocols to get pets noticed, marketed, fostered, adopted and rescued. Mr. Marsh doesn’t deny that there are 25 million homes looking for a new pet each year and that there are only 3-4 million that need to be placed. Now that is truly “replacing myth with math”.

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